I Think I Figured It Out

These longpost are special to me but i'm very opinionated but polite..will put little bits of info for clarification ==Mini Exo fandom analysis pt 1

lmao at people who actually thought the exo vocalists were at Zayn's caliber. Even Zayn "Bradford" Malik

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#zayn #zmalik #zquadofficial #onedirection #zaynmalik #zquad #zquadrecords #zaynmalikvids #zaynmalikvids #malikzayn #zayn_dio_lover

has to work hard to maintain his level of talent, touring is no joke and wears your vocals out that being said you should be able to get a clear grasp on somebody's best and their average

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#malikzayn #zaynmalikvids #zaynmalik #zquadrecords #zquad #zaynmalik__313 #zayn #onedirection #zmalik #zquadofficial #zmalik

I used zayn cause honestly I am trying to be fair and use a modern example and not people way back in the day. Also I remember this

jk jk. Girl I've never fan voted in my entire life, but I remember this happening though.

But using 1d and using the same standards some Exo supporters use when talking to fans of other kpop group

: do you really think people who aren't true artists of the craft can actually outdo people who can sing a soulful rnb song in their sleep? No, way too much association game being played. Just because s.m entertainment got a leg up from Quincy Jones

and got a bunch of his songwriters and associates and producers

(no this literally isn't even half of it lmao)

to help exo make 'black music'. "Popular music' "We can rock with this music'

Don't mean they are on that level like that. Please note the people that own this music and who own a lot of the music s.m used they all in some way go back to uptown

or motown

In some way, shape or form, because the black music industry was kept separate from the white for a long time, there's a very small crew and circle of people involved in the black music scene. A lot of it has merged into sub labels of larger companies like Universal or Sony. A lot of these songwriters of pretty much indentured and must continue to churn out these 'hits' and it doesn't necessarily matter where in the world it goes so long as it's sold.

They are classically trained singers and can do just as much as a classically trained singer around the world can. But they aren't blowing anyone outside of the average chaebol kid who don't even really care about performing out of the water. S.m taught them well but not nearly well enough for the ego their fans have developed.

Smtown entertainment was built off the foundation of motown, to be the korean version of motown. It's talent is mediocre compared to the original talent the company was based off of, but I suppose compared to the copy of a copy of a copy that exists in Kpop now it's something.

Personally they struggle to outdo Japanese acts artistically as well. In their heyday they created their own genres so unique japanese energy in and of itself was a movement, so I don't understand the superiority.

To be fair Japanese entertainment was on one back in the day from the 80s to early 2000s they ruled even American pop culture

Japan had a longer history with allowing it's citizens and artists freedom of expression, they were able to show out for a good while and gain respect slowly but surely in the international arts realm.

Korea tried to make up for decades of artistic freedom in like a single decade. They are still very rigid with their approach and of course adhere to the strict controlling method of the idol culture model, set by Japan who honestly was way loser even back in the day and even more now.

They critiqued obsessed idol fans back in the day with movies like perfect blue. Of course it still happened but trust when the modern culture shames something and the rest of the world is watching it does effect how people act. Imagine if their was an Hbo show that was about the kpop industry and obsessed kpop fans it definitely would make people tone down. People act differently when people really know what's going on in a situation.

Perfect blue is a mirror to fan culture at it's roots. It's fanatical, a bit unhinged but it's socially acceptable all the same.

A film I believe is necessary for anyone stuck in the idol worship process. It's 'these people don't know you' but artsy.

Even Lee Soo man sent Boa to japan to solidify her career back in the day.

They've had their gender wars, yaoi shotacon era, weird asf eras, religious guilt era, smooth jazz, blues, rap, kawaii, wannabe hood, what's our place in the universe era etc etc as a culture as a society. So their idol industry had a chance to grow slowly, rise up and simmer down naturally. Whereas Kpop just kind of had 20 or so years to boom and the artists have little more growth and development as a disney channel show after 3 seasons.

Boa of course went with the techno chic style that ruled Japan in the early 90s and she did very well.

America however is an entirely different beast, the talent in america is on a different level. Hybrid vigour going 1...2

but that's just a theory. Point is America's a different playground

(I was seven when I first watched her mv on mtv)

this is why most kpop gets their sound from abroad

(Boa's debut single eat you up was made by european producers I guess they were going for a more fusion Backstreet boys style american debut but there is a remix with Flo Rida)

(I may do a breakdown on this later, but it's just the way sm approached the whole thing. They wanted to create an urbanized Boa. That's such a dumb way to go about it. No concern for what actually fit her. That's sm's biggest mistake not letting their artists make their own decisions and be their own people. I watched an interview of her in La back in 2008/9 and she seemed like she was being shuffled around. This producer to that producer, now having to just become a whole new person. It didn't fit. Particularly because she wasn't american, it's not second nature or something she was at all used to.)

For s.m the superiority must be because the korean government is backing them up so they know they cannot fail. Now they feel superior to all of other asian talent and many go to korea to have a chance at becoming globally famous. That's fine.

Even fans of vocal deities don't go around disrespecting everyone like their fans do. Just because they made a point to imitate black singers and use their demos early in their career don't mean they are more elite than anybody else. I never see adele fans do this, it's giving insecurity. You don't have to keep repeating something everybody knows. I feel like as more time goes on the lack of originality is making their remakes more forgettable.

To use a comparison again, in one direction it was almost annoying how obsessed they were about songwriting, they were always in the studio trying to out do one another with the songs they made. Back in the day I thought it was pointless and I felt like Exo was more fun because they focused more on their bond and spending time together.

Now that I'm older it's woven all throughout the music that they had personal deep connections to what they were writing. This is why there are performances where the lyrics actually emotionally effect them, life, death, relationships, breakups, things the fans knew about things we didn't. That's what makes an artist.

Apparently a few members had writing credits on Kokobop and I read about what they said concerning it,

I will say that the group has added to a lot of their songs but I don't believe the craft for songwriting and composing becomes them. In Kpop I noticed many songs created lack a certain spark of life and personal touch

The fine details are also important, this isn't an exposing of the group simply clarification on things that aren't delved into. Many of the songs are remade and have a previous demo.

Knowing the background of the songwriting trio the stereotypes creating hits like Justin Bieber's somebody to love, Tomboy by Destiny Rodgers, Rocketeer by Far East Movement, they have quite a track record and their work is well known. I believe the average fan would give all the credit to Chanyeol because he 'worked on it'.

A very easy thing to find out but when people see an Exo members name on it many ignore anything else about it.

Especially with how they've regarded the black community in general. You truly wouldn't know the impact the black music industry had on kpop or sm unless you were american and it was just obvious to you already, or you researched and figured it out.

I bring this up to say the main compliment I see regarding exo's superior vocals is when members sing high notes and whatnot, which is fine. I love all types of vocals some of my favorite bands of all time is the fray and onerepublic, I purposely mention them because they are grown people music and not for immature 'stans' I hate whenever I bring up an artist that stan culture doesn't like and people bring up streams or who they dated as a drag. It's so immature and petty. So I use them because their music and vocals are not pass out but they are people who have mastered their own voice. It's unique, soulful and not trying to be anybody else. Personally to me this is when I know someone is a true master of their craft whenever they put their soul into their music when they sing.

In my personal opinion I always felt like I couldn't talk years ago, there was no room for oh yeah this artist kind of sings a bit better--if they didn't have stats, weren't popular it didn't matter. Yet, when people in the kpop fandom talked about their favorite artist they were top tier best in the industry and they had the numbers to prove it.

Now years later because the numbers aren't as good as people in the fandom may want it to be; they put other groups or artists down because they aren't real 'singers'. Then show clips of what is love/what if or some other obvious 90s rnb demo or a 90s japanese style pompeii style epic .

I just rarely see commentary about the obvious influences that were used to create the group that Exo's mythos/style/clothing and setup were based off of.

Which they can do because their leader/owner made friends with the right people and opened up a world of connections for them. Because many other groups have been cancelled for jacking theme's and concepts but that never happens with exo because sm owns/CALLS IN FAVORS/ with the media.

So those convo's are never had, so besides the average fanwar, most people can freely live in the world that exo is original and super duper talented above all others. Whenever someone wants to have a convo about this and actually know info about exo and can't just be deemed stupid and uneducated then 'it's not that important'

I tend not to bother or even talk about things that don't really irk me, but I can't lie sometimes I'm a bit irked. The false narratives truly do get to me, I remember a lot of stuff that many fans just weren't there for. I pass in on certain artists every now and then with Exo and Shinee being the only kpop boy groups I really listened to album after album, I keep wondering why I don't randomly get the urge to listen to them.

It could be a lot of reasons, bad memories, or I just am not into them as people. But celeb gossip to me means nothing. I don't care about rumors or someone's bad reputation if their music is good. It's not even the fandom cause some fandoms make me question humanity but when the beat drop I honestly don't really care

With Exo, honestly the music is something I have a hard time returning to. I once agreed with people that it was indeed better than other K-pop but now I'm starting to think that's a poor comparison. We are all equal, maybe not in ability but we all have the ability to put our heart and soul in what we do and if the music is good it should come off as right. There's little excuse when there are kids with youtube channels around the world who sound literally amazing, and they are no different than anybody, just singing to their heart's content. Passion, soul, drive. I believe that will always come off to others. It's what helped the civil rights cause for blacks back in the day, how they sang and danced. People just couldn't believe it.

Now we have an open market for talent so the competition is fierce but there is still people who blow listeners away. Every now and then I'll find a song that's good regardless of the singing style, they could be whispering or just humming and it sounds perfect, because they are doing what's for them.

Kpop is extremely manufactured to the point where this authenticity is very rare, few people truly sing with their heart and soul, it's mainly singing to impress and following a stiff formula. The problem with Exo mainly is the excellent catalogue they had access to, that lee soo man had access to. To me that was their ticket to stardom and a big reason not only for their success but the success of S.m entertainment as a whole. Many fans are less concerned with the details of how their artists and their work came to be and mainly are into the parasocial nature and competitive attitude of fandom for which the overall music and art suffers in my opinion.

The group finds little reason to give content and work very hard on their artistic ventures because honestly, who really cares. It's quite sad and the complete opposite of the music industry decades ago.

So most of the focus is just giving the group a concept, album or good song and the special touch the members give is next to none. The songs and albums could of been for anybody and deep down they know that which may lead to them being disconnected with their music.

Regardless as someone who watched many Untold stories about the black music industry, black artists were done bad, very badly, treated like dirt.

To see their music get new life is bittersweet because of the context in which it's happening, it seems ironic that people who care nothing for the cultural, political or even spiritual reasons for this music existing get to profit off of it. But that's just life. To get back into the talent aspect the singing in general all these years later I can hear now what my young ears couldn't. The vocal technique is mediocre and there is no attempt to fix it

Not only that fans who don't really care about vocal technique are going out of their way to claim not only is Exo superior to Kpop vocals which sure why not, but it's like a disrespectful attitude towards the black musicians and their 'versions'. As in the black musicians talent is ok but it couldn't compare to their Oppa's.

Many in kpop are guilty of this, but heavy is the head that wears the crown even after it's taken off. They are the kings of Kpop, no? Then they are responsible for inspiring the current generation more than anybody. If they are on the wrong path they are only following the example Exo set for them. They have called a lot of attention to their talent but I've yet to see them truly shine brighter than other's on their level. I believe there's a reason they stayed out of America. There is no such thing as constant popularity in the west. They don't just demand showing up and looking good and performing on a basic level. They want everything. Singing, dancing, choreography, artistry, political opinions etc etc.

Artists like Taylor Swift have written a majority of their music whether partially or fully. Hits and misses. It's a learning curve, but improvement is expected in the west. The more personal the better. Haley Williams also writes a majority of her music with her bandmates as well

Haley often talks first hand about her source of inspiration and always goes very deep when creating her music with her team.

constant artistic evolution is never easy there are blips and missteps but the point is an artist is responsible for putting their soul and passion into their work without concern of judgement.

Their hit Ain't it fun was unlike anything they'd done before fit with a gospel choir and all, it wasn't a sure hit but they went for it. A group can be an old group yet still keep it kicking artistically

weird and wacky can definitely work.

To keep going with the boyband contrasts Louis, and the other members, didn't just write one off songs he helped create songs that really had an impact on the group as well. This also helps with creativity because it must be discouraging to an artist to be an artist and have everything handed to them. How can they truly speak.

I put this in here because those boys really did work hard, they had a good run and they truly contributed to the music world despite having the most cookie cutter starting point.

End of Pt one

sweet i luv her

India.Arie — Jan. 9th, 2001

< singer, songwriter, the person I was named after >

insta: mtv.archives

twitter: mtvarchivez

Why S.M. didn't sabotage EXO... at least not how you think

S.m. did not sabotage Exo. They don't sabotage any of their groups. At least not how people think they do. Sure, from the fans and artists perspectives, I definitely think they may feel like that is the case, but we don't read their contracts. Heck, they probably didn't even read their contracts. Somebody can only screw you over if you let them.

It is possible to bargain and refuse to sign a contract if you don't want to. Multiple artists have left S.M. Entertainment and decided not to renew their contracts, but Exo, 8 members of Exo, did. They decided to stay in a contract locked tight with S.M. to stay in the group Exo.

Many say they had to; they had no choice, but they did. They could have all left together. There is no excuse for why they didn't. Because of the redraft of Korean entertainment laws to combat the exact thing that CBX sued for, the Korean government gave groups like Exo an out.

Which is why I knew they could not win their lawsuit, because it is very clear. It does protect the artists but it also protects the company. If you choose to resign odds are you will not win a lawsuit. The new law is a safety vest. If you throw it away you cannot cry foul.

There are many very helpful videos about this law that exist online. Groups can leave together with all their music and their name, but only if they leave together. Most likely what happened was some wanted to leave and some wanted to stay. It is quite clear who was on those two different sides.

The law is very specific that the thing is with this situation ALL the members must leave together if they want their name and music.

That right there would be, or should be, enough to stop this false claiming of S.M. mistreating Exo. Which, honestly, is kind of comical in 2024, the difference of the meaning of that word. Actual groups are abused by their agencies, and people think a company not making a group as famous as they could be is mistreatment.

It's not. And hey, if it was, and I'll give it to you, maybe that is a crappy thing to do, to block offers and say, Nah, we're not going to make you more famous but...

They could have left; they all had the free will to leave.

Though that would mean no more S.M. promotions, no more S.M. paying for everything, and no more benefits. Do I really have to go to the s.m. website and show you all the benefits they give to their employees? I mean, it's pretty nice. Sadly, we live in a world of comparison. People are desperate to find some comparison between the haves and the have-nots. Maybe if these millionaires aren't getting the highest pay in the company, then they deserve people to rally for them.

It's like a huge victim off--who is the least privileged rich person.

it's giving

But it's not even as simple as that. S.m invests a lot of money into each artist. They made them famous, they built them up, they got them sponsorships and acting jobs, and like it or not, they got them a fandom too. From S.M.'s perspective, they made the group. I mean, fans are shallow, and they want content and fan service, which is valid. I mean, if you like a show, sure you want more seasons, but these are real people. It takes millions to get these guys a reality show, wearing fancy clothes, with makeup artists and a camera crew with a rented-out villa. On top of feeding everyone, staff, managers, producers and stylists.

Meanwhile, some groups have personal YouTube channels just hanging out. Like the comparison is not valid. Like yes, they are so oppressed they have to spend tons of money giving their fans a fancy reality show to watch and heavily scripted and edited YouTube sketches.

S.m truly hates their guts so much they let them rag on them in public and on bubble and still buy them birthday cakes lmao.

I mean, think about that: Who needs all that to hang out with their friends? People bend over backwards to make it seem like S.M. is sabotaging them with no content... like it's not hard to hang out and film it. It's not S.M.'s fault they need a script or be at a concert in order to have chemistry. Kai said himself it took him a long time to get a youtube channel because he had to organize and pay for everything. It's expensive to do what they want to do. Look perfect, have great editing and keep their image fancy.

There are tons of issues in Kpop and s.m ent but complaining about the most pointless things takes validity away from the argument.

"But ...they cancelled youtube red reality show/ they said no to cochella" allegedly..

Do ya'll understand that those are avenue's that can't be controlled. Look at what happened to those poor girls who went to that event and got trashed for weeks. Anything can happen and it's not an asian event. Exo has had bad performances in the past, mess ups, bad notes, if that happened in a crowd full of foreigners who may not even be into kpop; they aren't women who can just laugh it off cause they look like instagram models, that would be humiliating. People are way meaner to men on the internet.

Do I need to bring back the last time S.m and fans tried to push exo performing at a western event, a very traditional group of people opposed it heavily citing it was an american event and began picking the group apart. Gender and race are a huge issue companies are hesistant how they bring a group to the west. They purposely promoted super m differently to prevent a bad reaction from certain groups of people. They wore less makeup, did less overt fanservice and made sure they promoted them more masculine. They always referred to one another as brother. They don't want to put their groups in a bad spot and I don't blame them.

Did people ever think that the group may not of been the best group to perform at that type of event. They have a lot of members and cochella isn't known for focusing on dancing. Some members don't even have lines in most songs, they would just be standing there. They aren't blackpink or 2ne1 with only four members who equally share lines.

I don't remember other large groups crying cause they weren't invited to cochella, because every market is different. Rappers, bands and female performers do better at cochella than dudes and there's nothing wrong with that.

How can 9 people sing equally at a musical event?

"Youtube offered them a show why didn't s.m take it"

With Youtube red...can exo be as authentic as the documentary may require? Can they have a scene with serious or contraversial stuff like hybe is doing and their fans be okay with that? Maybe that wasn't a risk they were willing to take. They have a completely different promotion style than other companies. The fans do not know these people. What if the members had to show their real authentic personalities? Would fans even be interested in that? It could destroy the fourth wall s.m built up for them. Fans would rather ignore issues just like the lawsuit, they plug their ears and cover their eyes, even when it was cbx who tried to call attention to it. They were trying to say they had an issue but fans just wanted more fluffy content and were upset the lawsuit messed it up for them. So could the fandom take a documentary where problematic stuff might be filmed? The fans themselves might of boycotted youtube.

They would of been like:

"How dare they put the boys in a bad light. S.m should have protected them"

The members are known for saying stuff that got them in trouble with foreign american fandoms. What if it caused more trouble than it was worth?

That's how companies have to think.

I understand that there are many things which do need to be talked about concerning exo, s.m and kpop but the reality is that be honest most do not want to have those conversations. How many injuries and people passing out had fans rolling their eyes saying "again?"

or "screw s.m"

what does that do?

People don't even know how to boycott because they are so addicted to their faves being top sellers and milking their achievements. How can people say they don't care when they talk about exo's awards like they earned them themselves. The only award a fan should be proud of is a grammy because there's a council of critics who are unbias not a bunch of crazy fans.

When people let go of their ego then change will happen until then the companies will continue to do whatever they want. Having underage children dancing in a basement learning how to attract fans is an issue. Millionaires getting less money than they thought they could get is not.

even better what if they want to publicly date? What if they want to go on insta live with their partner, what if they want to discuss their crush on the internet. What if they want to take photos in the club with their partner or crush and post it what about that? This don't ask don't tell policy is equally unhealthy. It's normal to be curious about someone's love life but it's not normal for them to loose their career over dating someone. Maybe other things need to be confronted like why groups need to be best friends for people to like their music.

everyone repeat after me: “idol relationships are not any of my business and i do not need to know whether they’re in a relationship or not bc that is their personal life and they are a real living human being just like i am and it is not my place to invade their privacy or demand to know their private lives when they sacrifice enough of their privacy just by being an idol”

Redemption - [DAY_966] The End of Evangelion.

eleanor in park indie film by next year