Bessatsu Magazine - Q&A With Isayama

“Never let the future disturb you. You will meet it, if you have to, with the same weapons of reason which today arm you against the present.”

— Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

Analyzing Eren`s view of freedom

Concepts, ideas and philosophies are abstract phenomena which do not technically have any physical form. However people like to depict these ideas in different ways. For example the idea of justice is depicted by a goddess, who holds a scale and is blindfolded. The reason why I bring this up, is because AoT volume 33 visualizes the idea of freedom. In a beautiful yet haunting spread panel, the reader sees a young Eren high up in the sky. The sky, clouds and overall horizon seems to stretch into eternity, and at this high viewpoint there is nothing that binds Eren. In one hand this vision is Eren`s dream, the outside world that Eren dreamed about all those years ago. It is this dream among his loved one`s that Eren wishes to retain/pursue, by using the Rumbling. However since Eren describes the view as “freedom” and the person who has seen it as “the freest person in the world”, I think it encapsulates what Eren thinks freedom is. In this post I`d like to examine what this possibly means.

One mention has to be made. I have read up till volume 33 and so I do not know how the story ends. Because of this I cannot comment on some possible revelations that happen after this point. I will start the post by dissecting Eren`s vision into different elements. Then in the final portion I will go over what problems this vision has. The structure will be the following one:

- Limitless horizon and the state of nature

- Chasing a mysterious and unknown horizon

- The vision of a child – Problems with Eren`s view of freedom

- Conclusion

Limitless horizon and the state of nature

Eren`s vision of freedom is constructed from several building blocks, some more complex than others. In its basic form when one thinks about the society and world where Eren was born in, this vision is a stark contrast to that. The place Eren was born in was small, cramped and binding. As he himself tells in volume 33, from the day Eren was born those massive walls were always there. The walls obscured the horizon and made it hard to see what was past them.

They were a constant reminder of Eren`s nature as a caged being. Because of this Eren`s dream and idea of freedom has to be different from a visual perspective. Here there are no physical boundaries obscuring the horizon, and the sky stretches as far as the eye can see. The outside world is an expansive place, something that must be ten times bigger than Paradis. At this high position it is as if Eren has become the bird or obtained the wings, that have always been depicted to symbolize freedom. He can go where-ever he wants and only sky is the limit.    

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from how the manga spoilers are looking I’m not going to have enough motivation or reason to complete this comic, I’m sad but I wanted to share what I drew of it.

context: mikasa and armin confronting eren in paths after eren badly injured mikasa

Humankind cannot bear very much reality.

T.S. Eliot, from Four Quartets; Burnt Norton. (via xshayarsha)

SNK 139.5: Towards the Final Pages with no Final Answers

The final pages of the updated ending are bold, but I think ultimately more evocative than the original preliminary ending.

Even after the intensely polarized reader reception that took issue with the lack of storytelling precision and clarity when it was most needed, SNK chose to end with a decisively ambiguous symbol. In literature, a symbol is something that clearly means something -- but with the most "literary" symbols, their meaning cannot be absolutely defined; any attempted answer as to what a symbol represents has no finality or certainty, and interpretation will remain ever open to debate. A symbol both invites and resists interpretation.

Naturally, the immediate response to the symbolic tree on the final page is to try answering the invitation to the question, "What does it mean?"

One prominent answer I've seen is that it symbolizes the continuation of the cycle of war and violence either because a) of the symbolic parallel to Ymir or b) on a more literal level, that it implies the actual potential revival of new era of Titans. A reasonable interpretation either way, but also, I think, an incomplete one.

The first reason for this is that "the endless cycle of war" was already clearly and powerful represented in the preceding panels:

The cycle of war was already continuing in the decades or centuries before the child arrived at the tree. A culminating image symbolizing the persistence or resurgence of an era of war as the final panel would thus arguably be redundant and unnecessary.

Furthermore, the chapter is entitled "Toward the Tree on That Hill." If the tree were simply a symbol of war, by implication the chapter could equally be called 'toward the endless cycle of war'. But such a relentlessly bleak and tonally flat ending sentiment would be firmly incongruous with the story's recurrent conviction in the equal cruelty and beauty of the world -- a conviction that I believe it has been faithful to all the way to its end.

The Long Defeat

But while on this topic of war, let's linger a moment on the "cruelty" side and the consequence of this wordless construction and subsequent destruction of a city -- the most bold and possibly controversial additional panels that are also my personal favourite additions.

One objection that has emerged against this brief sequence of Paradis' apparent destruction is that it renders the entire story to be "pointless". Eren's 80% Rumbling, Armin's diplomatic peace talks between the remnants of the Allied Nations and Paradis, and before that, the proposal of the 50-year plan and Zeke's euthanasia plan... everything, to the very beginning to the Survey Corps' dreams of some kind of freedom; was it all for nothing? All that striving, that hope, that final promise bestowed upon Armin: was it all a pointless story? Even more radically, is the story suggesting that Eren might as well have continued the Rumbling to 100% of the earth? Was Zeke's euthanasia plan the cruel but correct choice all along? What was the point of rejecting the 50-year plan if that had a greater chance of success at preventing this outcome?

I think Isayama suddenly pulling back to such a long-term view of history to the scale of decades or even centuries into the future calls for a reorientation in attitude towards exactly what kind of story we have been reading. Yes, if the metric is Paradis' survival, maybe it was indeed all "pointless". But that's also to say that, on the broadest scale, SNK is a story about futility, that it is a deliberate representation of the struggle to make one's actions historically meaningful.

In the long view of history, all the events, from Grisha running beyond the wall to see the airships and the first breaking of Wall Maria to Erwin's sacrifices, Paradis' discovery of the outside world, and finally to the Battle of Heaven and Earth, it would all merely be a handful of chapters in the history textbooks of the future. A future in which war and geopolitical conflict will continue even without Titans. That does not mean that all paths to the future are equal -- the 50-year plan would not have put an end to Titans, and Zeke's euthanasia plan distorts utilitarian ethics into just another form of oppression; there are better and worse decisions that lead to more and less degrees of suffering, but no decision can ever be the final one.

The additional panels remind us that in history, there never exists a singular "Final Solution". The reason there are readers who vehemently support Eren to have flattened 100% of the world, and the reason the Paradisians supported the oppressive, authoritarian, proto-fascist Jaegar Faction under Floch and even after the Rumbling, is that because they want to believe that a Final Solution to end conflict exists and will work. They resist the fundamental uncertainty and complexity of the situation, instead preferring a singular, unified, and coherent Answer to Paradis' struggle to survive. I'm reminded of the scholar Erich Auerbach's theorization of why fascism appealed to many people during periods of political and social crisis, change, and uncertainty. Writing in exile after fleeing Nazi Germany, he observed that:

"The temptation to entrust oneself to a sect which solved all problems with a single formula, whose power of suggestion imposed solidarity, and which ostracized everything which would not fit in and submit - this temptation was so great that, with many people, fascism hardly had to employ force when the time came for it to spread through the countries of old European culture." (from Mimesis p. 550)

This acutely describes the Jaegar Faction's rise to power and continued dominance in Paradis. But their promise of unity, of a single formula to wipe out the rest of the world either literally through the Rumbling, or to dominate them with military force, is a false one. Even if Eren had Rumbled 100% of the world instead of 80%, history would still go on. The external threat of the world may have been eliminated, but internal conflict and violence would still continue onward throughout the generations born on top of the blood of the rest of the world. Needless to say, out of all the options, Eren's 80% Rumbling is the very epitome of perpetuating the cycle of violence as it creates tens of thousands of war orphans like Eren once was, and it would justify employing violence for one's own self-interest to an extreme degree. For the generations to come that would valourize Eren as a hero, it would set a dangerous precedent for what degree of destruction is acceptable for self-defence -- nothing short of the attempt to flatten the entire world. It is no surprise that Paradis would meet a violent end when its founding one-party rule of the Jaegar Faction has their roots in such unapologetically bloody foundations.

Neither the 80% Rumbling nor the militaristic, ultra-nationalistic Jaegar faction that come to govern Paradis are glamourized as the "correct" solution to ensuring Paradis' future. (This can also put to rest any accusations of SNK's ending as "fascist" or "imperialist" propaganda, since the island's modern nation that they founded ends in war. All nations must fall eventually, but not all do in such blatant destruction). Importantly, neither is Armin's diplomatic mission naively idealized as that which permanently achieves world peace. No singular or unifying formula can work because reality is complicated. Entrusting oneself to seemingly simple Answers is simply insufficient, even if they are ideals of peaceful negotiation; that method may work given the right conditions, but the world will always eventually complicate its feasibility.

After all in the real world, there's the absurd irony that some in the West had called the First World War "The War to End all Wars". These days, WWI is merely one long chapter in our textbooks just a few pages away from the even longer chapter of the Second World War that is followed by all the rest of the conflicts that have followed since then even with the establishment of diplomatic organizations like the United Nations. In this sense, showing Paradis' eventual downfall is perhaps the only way to end such a series that is so concerned with history, from King Fritz's tribal expansion into empire, the rise and fall of Marleyan ascendency, and finally of the survival and apparent shattering of Paradis.

From its beginning to its end, SNK has poignantly evoked J.R.R. Tolkien's conception of history as The Long Defeat. In one character's words, "together through ages of the world we have fought the long defeat". That is to say, "no victory is complete, that evil rises again, and that even victory brings loss".

No heroes, only humans

Eren's desperate, fatalistic resignation to committing the Rumbling, along with the characters' rejection of all the rest of the earlier plans to ensure Paradis a future, are merely the actions of human beings to that began with the need to find not even necessarily a Final Answer, but at least an acceptable and feasible one for the time being. But the characterization of Eren's confusion, childishness, and regret in the final chapter is startlingly real in how it demonstrates how, all along, we have been dealing not with grand heroes, but simply people who have no answers at all. SNK has always been about failures - and often ironic failures; it has always been a story about painful and frequently futile struggle.

People make mistakes, they can be short-sighted, selfish, biased, immature, petty, and irrational, and I think the ending follows through with depicting the consequences of that.

Erwin's self-sacrifice before being able to reach the basement (and his regression to a childhood state in the moments before his death), Kenny's futile chasing after that universal compassion he had seen in Uri, Shadis never being acknowledged by history despite his final heroic action, and so on -- these stories of ironic, futile failures are still meaningful in their mere striving. Eren's ending and Paradis' demise despite Armin's endeavour to ensure them a peaceful future are entirely consistent with this.

SNK certainly follows the shounen trope in which young individuals are bestowed great power and correspondingly great responsibility, and must then reconcile the burden of possessing that greatness on which the fate of the world depends. Yet it is equally defined by its representation of the state that us normal human beings confront everyday: the struggle against the apparent powerlessness to enact any meaningful or lasting change at all. Simultaneously, this helpless state does not exempt us from the responsibility to act in whatever small capacity we are able to resist oppression, ideological extremism, and the perpetuation of violence.

Towards That Symbol

That was a rather long but vital digression about the additional "construction and destruction" pages. To return to the issue of the symbolism in the final panel, here I will turn from seemingly affirming the tree as symbolizing the cycle of violence, towards what I think is the greater complexity of what the tree might "actually" symbolize.

As I've said above, I don't believe that the final chapter title is synonymous with 'toward the endless cycle of war'. In tone, theme, and characterization, SNK has always been defined by the tension between cruelty and beauty, the will to violence and the underlying desire for peace, and the rest of the contradictory impulses that all simultaneously coexist. The end of SNK as a whole commits to a similar lack of closure, ambiguity, and interpretive openness.

So far I have rambled on about only a view of the perpetual "cruelty" of history. Where, then, is the "beauty"?

In short, the "tree = cycle of violence" interpretation is obviously based on how that this tree recalls the original tree in which the spine creature, as the source of the power of the Titans, resided. But it's worth first considering, what exactly is this creature? We seem to get our answer in the chapter that most precisely crystallizes the dual "cruelty and beauty" of the world:

The spine creature might be said to be life itself. Or more specifically, the will of life to perpetuate itself, for no reason at all but for the fleeting moments in which we feel distinctly glad to have existed in the world.

The creature at the source of the Titans, and in extension the Titans themselves, is neither inherently a positive or negative, "good" or "evil", creative or destructive force. It's both and all of those at once. As with any power, the Titans were merely a tool that was put to use to oppressive ends.

So as I now suggest that the tree at the end is symbolically a "Tree of Life", I don't at all mean "life" in the typically celebratory or optimistic sense: rather, I mean it in the ambiguous, ambivalent, uncertain, and complex sense that has been evoked throughout the above discussion of the inevitable continuation of war.

The title "Toward The Tree on That Hill" is derived from its associations with Eren and Mikasa, but more specifically of course, from Armin's affirmation of existence. However, the tree as a symbol of existential affirmation is undercut with the revelation that, despite Armin's diplomatic mediation between the Allied Nations and Paradis, the island nation never escapes war just as no nation in the history of the earth has ever fully escaped war.

The image of Armin running toward that life-affirming tree by the end becomes twisted and complicated, as the image of the anonymous child approaching the Tree of Life evokes both awe at its beauty and grandeur, and a deep dread at the foreboding of its cyclical return to Ymir's tree that signalled the beginning of a bloody era.

And I think that is precisely it: Life is not some idealized, beautiful vision that we always want to run toward; it is also ironic, complicated, and dreadful. It is ambivalent. Like a literary symbol, the meaning of life cannot be pinned down absolutely. The tree therefore becomes itself a symbol of uncertainty, of an open future that is cyclical both in its beauty and war.

As a final observation, it is surely no coincidence that, the small, black, birdlike silhouettes of the war planes destroying the city from the sky is replaced by the similarly small black silhouettes of birds in the final panel.

If the birds represent freedom from war, the irony is that the immediately surrounding land appears to be one completely empty of people save for the exploring child; it is a freedom attained only without people's presence. Yet at the same time, a child from some existing civilization has reached it; perhaps it is freedom that they have reached, perhaps it is something else that they see in the tree. What is it that they were looking for? What does the tree and its history represent for the child, and what does it mean for their future? Alternatively, does the child-in-the-forest imagery negatively recall the warning that the world is one huge forest of predator and prey that we need to protect children from entering?

Rather than providing answers, this tree embodies all of the potential questions, and all of the potential answers. These possibilities will unfold themselves into an uncertain future beyond the chapters of history that Eren, Armin, Mikasa, Zeke, Erwin, and all the rest of the characters were part of and left their mark on; and whatever future this child will witness or create, it will similarly be one of the struggle against futility, as the journey begins anew with each generation in every new era. Neither - or both - hopeful or despairing, the final image of this tree, just like life itself, contains those innumerable irresolvable tensions as it gestures towards all possibilities, both oppressive and free.

SnK Interviews: Isayama Hajime’s Q&A from Febri Vol. 42 (July 2017 Issue)

Translations by @suniuz & @fuku-shuu - Please give credit/link back if used!

- What is your most essential drawing tool? 9mm 2B pencil lead. As it’s both thick yet soft, it’s easy to erase cleanly, so I enjoy using it the most. I don’t really understand the differences between all the manufacturers, so as long as the lead is this exact type, I’m fine with whichever.

- What do you do when you’re not working? I play video games. My nephews have been visiting me recently, so I have them bring their controllers and play Splatoon with them.

- Who is your favorite character in Shingeki no Kyojin? Reiner. As time progresses, my favorite character keeps shifting. My favorite is Reiner at the moment - I want to draw more and more of Reiner.

- Favorite music as of late? Kiyoshi Ryuuji. Even though my all-time favorite is Shinsei Kamattechan, who sang the SnK S2 ED, my favorites as of late are Creepy Nuts and Kiyoshi Ryuuji. For Kiyoshi, every single one of his songs has been a hit - even those he produced for others - which is an incredible success rate. I feel like he’s like Hyadain-san (T/N: Famous Japanese composer and lyricist), only he can also sing and dance.

- Favorite manga as of late? Boku-tachi ga Yarimashita (T/N: We Did It). The author, Kaneshiro Muneyuki (T/N: The artist for the title is Araki Hikaru), is my contemporary at Bessatsu Shonen. It’s just such an incredible piece of work. Initially I already had good feelings toward him because we started out together, and when I reached the middle of the story I suddenly went, “Eh? This manga is a masterpiece…?” I even got goosebumps. He created an unbelievable story, so I’m thrilled as his contemporary.

- Favorite video game as of late? Wii U’s Splatoon. Even though the game has been on sale for two years already, I’m still playing it consistently. It has been a long while since I started, but I still feel like I’m terrible at the game. Nonetheless, through my personal efforts, I experienced what it means to “achieve” different degrees of success for the first time. I can’t get enough of it!

- When did you start drawing manga? 2nd year of high school (T/N: That’s equivalent to junior year). But if you count just single illustrations, I already started when I was in daycare. But I remember that it wasn’t until 2nd year of high school when I actually organized drafts and began to create manga.

- How much do you sleep on average? About 8 hours. When I first started serialization, I had a little less sleep. But lately if I don’t get enough sleep I can’t do anything else.

- Recent interests? Watching foreign drama series. I’m currently anticipating the 7th season of Game of Thrones, which will start in July. Other than that, I’m hesitating on whether or not I should watch House of Cards (T/N: YES YOU SHOULD). When I watch something exciting, the amount of energy I use up is similar to if I read all of One Piece in just a week. Hence, I’m actually becoming a little scared about doing this (T/N: Committing to another show) [Laughs].

- If you lived within the Walls? I would be a farmer. Because I want to avoid all responsibilities [Laughs], so I want to live on the border and just plant crops. Though I can imagine that this kind of lifestyle has its own hardships, I would never be a soldier.

- What’s the best thing about being a mangaka? Everything. If I didn’t become a mangaka, I feel like I would’ve descended into poor health - to the extent where I couldn’t even go to the convenience store. I am totally serious [Laughs].

- Favorite movie as of late? It Follows. It was probably my first time watching such a scary film. Of course, the storyline is exciting, but on top of that, the actual elements of horror were fantastic. Because this movie describes something that happens at your own household, I felt jumpy and scared in my apartment for two weeks after I watched it.

- If you weren’t drawing manga? I would become an average member of society. But if possible, I would probably become a craftsman. Before when I worked at an internet cafe, no matter how dirty the cubicles became, I always bet my entire life on making it spotless again. It was almost like Nietzsche’s “Sublimation” psychology [Laughs]. Thinking back, I guess that could just be part of an artisan’s personality, too.

- What do you do when you experience writer’s block? I dive into other creative works. Basically other films, drama series, and manga - and I search for elements I enjoy. But because this world is filled with so many incredible works that I’ll never fully experience - even if I spend my entire life trying - as long as I commit to the ones I enjoy the most, my life can progress with inspiration. Sometimes, I almost feel like there is no actual need for me to draw manga [Laughs].

- The best thing about your hometown (Oita prefecture)? Delicious plum wine. When I think of what’s most appealing about my hometown, plum wine immediately comes to mind. My family back home are plum farmers, so even though I sound like I’m self-promoting my relatives’ business, please do give our Yumehibiki plum wine a taste! [Laughs]

- Your first impression of Tokyo? Surprisingly warm/familiar. At the railroad crossing of Egota, my head somehow got knocked by the crossing gate there, and I thought, “So Tokyo isn’t just all about tall buildings…” My memory contains moments of calm like this [Laughs].

We’re working on the highlights/new information from the main interview between Isayama and editor Kawakubo as well - stay tuned!

Eren’s Founder and Jung’s Archetypes

The appearance of Eren’s Founding Titan form, its shape and symmetry, seems very esoteric somehow. One is called to mind Jung’s theory of Archetypes, the base symbols that are shared in the collective unconscious of all human psyches. These symbols are then used in the religions and mythologies of cultures across the world.

The eery artistic power of Eren’s Founder perhaps comes from its Archetypal resemblance to figures such as the Hanged Man in the occult practice of Tarot cards. Eren’s torso looks as though it is hanging downwards in the manner of the Hanged Man.

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Thank you :) The praise is probably undeserved though. Eren is the only character I try to really dig deeper into. The series as a whole has way better analysts.

Which snk meta writers would you recommend? And what are your favourite snk metas not written by you? Yours are still amazing, but I've probably read them all a thousand times so I was curious about others.

Honestly I never read as much of other people's meta as I should, and in retrospect that was a mistake. I mostly just wanted to avoid heated discourse, and while seeing a bad take can cause me to see red, it's extremely useful to build on the good ideas of others.

I haven't read their recent stuff but I remember really liking the metas of @metasnkpotato, they clearly know their philosophy. More recently I've found @twilight-paradise88, who I think is probably closer to a 'correct' analysis of the series than any other.

please make your choice

never thought I would do manga colourings for this but here I am